| Name | Post |
| dman007 | I have 914-6 clone with a 2.2 911E motor. Someone prior to me installed a hot start relay. Occasionally when I have tried to start the car(usually cold), I turn the key and nothing happens. The only sound I hear is the key turning(excepting the fuel pump). If I get under the car and jump across the hot start relay, the starter will turn. The car will now start without a problem. Just exactly what does this hot start relay do? What is the problem it is suppose to eliminate? Is this relay now more the problem than the solution? What is the right way to eliminate any of these problems? Any advise in this area would be greatly appreciated. |
| JP Noonan | The "Hot Start Relay" is something done to fix a problem with "line loss" or "resistence" in the line. Electricity flows with a force called current (mabye volts, I forget) the further the curent flows,i.e. the longer the wire, the less power (amps) reach the circut (starter motor, headlights,etc.). +12 volt D.C. systems are most suseptible to this, I think that is why electric companies use A.C. What can be done is to either increase the size of the wire or shorten the run of the wire. The way my 914 works (a 74 with parts of a 72 wiring harness) is +12 goes from the batt. to the ing. switch, then to the relay board, and finnally to the starter selonoid. About 12-14 feet! The wire on the 72 was larger then the 74 that is why I replaced it (plus the 74 had that crazy seatbelt lock out thingy). The +12 to the starter motor is about 7-8 ga. and goes from the batt right to the starter. About 54". Soooooo.... What the hot start relay does is to use a 30+ amp relay to entergize the started and selonoid right from the 7-8 ga wire off the batt. instead of the 14' wire from the ing. The relay (if it is a little black 1" cube made by Bosch) only needs .5 amps to switch the 30 amp switch inside it. This effectivly shortens the 12-14' to about 4". Now the reason you might need this relay is that the wires are old and have built up internal resistance (corrosion) or the starter motor os old and when hot needs more power to turn over. If shorting out the relay helped then I would say that the relay contacts, either at the relay or at the starter , are coroded. So remove all the connections and clean them with fine sand paper (I like Scotch Brite pads) replace the relay (if it is a Bosch car stereo places sell them for about $5-10) and when you reconnect everything use dielectric grease or some sort of ing. and batt. sealer. |
| Marc Le Friant | I had some problems starting my '76 on occasion and tried everything to fix it- rebuilding the starter, adding the relay kit, everything. I think what finally fixed the problem was to take out the relay board (the big black thing on the driver's side of the engine compartment, and went through with a razor blade to expand all the pins for the multipin connectors from the engine and chassis wiring harness. You see, the yellow starter line has to be routed through this relay board to get from the ignition switch to the starter and over the years the pins that allow the two sections of wire to be continuous collapse inward, giving a less than perfect connection. So expand the pins, clean them up, and use contact cleaner to keep yourself trouble free in this regard for at least a couple years. My explanation may be vague, but you'll see what I mean if and when you get into this. |
| Dave_Darling | I think one of the reasons that people install the relay is because they can't figure out anything else to do when they have starter problems. From your description, it sounds like you're getting power to the relay, but either the "signal" to the relay is not getting there or the relay itself is failing. A relay is a solenoid-operated switch. If you put a sufficient voltage across the two "signal" inputs, the "input" gets connected to the "output". On the 914, the round relays use terminal 30 for the input, terminals 85 and 86 for the "signal", and 87 for the "output". (87a is connected to 30 when there is NO voltage across the "signal" inputs, but it isn't used at all in a 914 that I've found yet.) The common way of wiring a cold-start relay is to put power to the "input" directly from the battery. One of the "signal" inputs is wired directly to ground. The "output" goes directly to the starter. The other "signal" has the original ignition wire running to it. So, when you turn the key, one signal wire will go to +12V while the other is 0V (ground). That will connect the input (battery power) to the output (starter). Get it? Your possible problems include: Bad relay, bad connections, bad wire to ground or to the starter switch, or possibly a partly-burned switch. The burned switch, BTW, is often caused by "kickback voltage" arcing across the switch. This can be eliminated by using a diode in the right place. --DD |
| Dave_Darling | Oh, yeah--if you *do* have a burned ignition switch, Pelican has a nice article on how to replace it. Use the search engine, or look in the list of tech articles. --DD |
| Wayne at Pelican Parts | Good call Dave, I would add a hot start relay, and replace the ignition switch just to be safe... Thanks, Wayne |